After a certain pause, the presidents of our countries met twice this year. First in Chisinau, second time in Athens. It was a very fruitful encounter and they understood each other. In the statement issued by President Aleksandar Vu?i?, as well as in the statement of President Volodymyr Zelensky, we see that they were completely satisfied with this meeting, the ambassador of Ukraine to Serbia Volodymyr Tolkach said on the show “Half an hour of Demostat”. Speaking about bilateral relations between Serbia and Ukraine, our interlocutor also pointed out: “We are waiting for the activation of our dialogue, we had that dialogue before this war started, before 2014, and it is my duty to accelerate our contacts in all spheres”.

Asked how many Ukrainians were killed, wounded and displaced during the Russian invasion of Ukraine, which began almost 600 days ago, Tolkach said: “it is a difficult question for us because we cannot now assess all our tragedies, especially the deaths of our civilians and children. But first I would like to say, its not just 600 days of this war. This war began in 2014, when Russian aggressors came to Crimea and Donbas. But now we have more than five hundred children who have died in our country, as well as more than 10,000 civilians who have been killed and about 16,000 wounded. Unfortunately, the only information we have is from UN organizations about Ukraine, and its not accurate. Unfortunately, these numbers can be much higher”.

The Ukrainian ambassador adds: “many Ukrainians are displaced. More than 10 million people have been displaced in our country and have gone to other countries as refugees. This figure varies widely, as many have returned from exile, so it cannot be calculated very precisely. But I think thats more than 10 million people”.

Asked about people from Ukraine who have come to Serbia since February 2022, Demostats interlocutor points out: "today in Serbia we have more than 6,000 people who have applied for temporary residence here. Also, we have a center in Vranje that is specially designed for accommodation of Ukrainians. There are about 60 people there, primarily women with children and the elderly. Many people are here in Serbia, especially in Belgrade, and that is, approximately 6,000 people. I know that about 25,000 Ukrainians crossed the borders with neighbouring EU states and with Serbia... Some of them have relatives or friends here, and they are housed there, but, as I mentioned before, about sixty Ukrainians are in Vranje. I would like to take this opportunity to thank your Government for providing really good conditions for these people - they have food, the opportunity to live in good conditions, children can go to sports, so we are very grateful, these are some of the best conditions, not only in the Balkans, but in the world as a whole”.

Answering the question whether he is dissatisfied with the fact that Serbia has not imposed sanctions on Russia and how he views the statements of certain Ukrainian deputies that Ukraine should recognize Kosovo, Tolkach notes: “you see, first of all, at the official level, we always state from the beginning, since 1999,  they we support Serbias territorial integrity. That attitude has never changed when it comes to our President, the Foreign Minister. Therefore, we do not officially recognize Kosovo as an independent state and we always support the territorial integrity of Serbia”.

“Secondly, today, when we have a full-scale aggression carried out by the Russian Federation, our people always look around and ask, above all, their deputies, their representatives in the Parliament: why do we not want to support Kosovo, when Kosovo fully supports us? Sometimes it is very difficult to give a complete answer, that it is international law and international principles that bind. Yes, some of our deputies have raised this issue, but on the basis that Kosovo fully supports Ukraine. We would also appreciate it if we could see how Serbia fully supports Ukraine. This would not only make us happy, but also make it clear that the whole of Europe supports us. Without political, economic and other support, it would be very difficult for Ukrainians to persevere in this war.

Tolkach also commented on the fact that the vast majority of pro-regime media in Serbia is pro-Russian, which is accompanied by an anti-Western narrative, and he also referred to the Russian disinformation campaign in our country.

“I can tell you that we, Ukraine, have lost time. We were convinced that by supporting Serbia, we would have the support of Serbia in all spheres. We lost time and gave the Russians an opportunity to strengthen their influence in Serbia. And our Western colleagues also, unfortunately, paid much more attention to economic issues-investments, economic support for Serbias growth. This war is not only fought with weapons, but also with information. I think we need to speed up this process and one of the reasons I am here today is to convey real, true information about Ukraine and the war”.

Asked whether he expects Ukraine to become a NATO member in the near future, given the view of some Alliance officials think this will only happen once the war in Ukraine is over, Tolkach said: “this issue is very difficult for us, because sometimes it is argued that it would have been better if it had happened sooner. In 2008 we had a chance to join NATO. I dont like the term “NATO expansion”. This is not a “NATO expansion” because each country can decide for itself how to build its defence. In this case, I think that the Baltic states, as well as the Eastern European ones, tried to hide under that umbrella because they saw an enemy in the East, especially the Russian Federation. It would be better for Ukraine to join NATO as soon as possible, because in that case we would have more economic and military assistance. Many Ukrainians died in this war and after that it became clear that this is one of the main reasons why this (NATO membership) is so important.

Responding to the question of whether NATO should engage more and help Ukraine, Volodymyr Tolkach said: “Indeed, NATO have supported us. We are very grateful to NATO for this. Without this support, it would be very difficult for Ukraine to persevere in this fight against the Russian aggressors. When someone tries to point out: ”this is a war between NATO and Russia”, it is a lie, which first came from Russian journalists, from Russian propaganda. Ukraine is now trying to persevere in this war and not only defend itself, although it primarily defends itself, but also to defend other European states from the aggressors. Many Eastern European states can be attacked after Ukraine by Russian fascists and their ideology”.

“Fortunately, we feel this support (by NATO), we need this support. Had we not had new tanks, new air defence systems, we would have lost even more soldiers and civilians. We are grateful, above all to the NATO, to the states of the alliance, as well as to others who support us in this war.

Commenting on the decision by the Alliance to send additional troops to Kosovo, the Ukrainian ambassador says: “you see, first of all, the peace needs to be preserved. Peace in all European countries, because without peace there is no development. We see that many villages and towns in Ukraine have been completely destroyed by Russian aggressors. How to defend ourselves? I have a good example for you. For more than 10 years, our peacekeepers have protected Serb enclaves in Kosovo. It was good for all of us. Next week, I will be visiting KFC. Weve been doing it for eleven years. Without NATO, without KFOR, it would be difficult to defend ourselves, because today someone is trying to provoke a bloody conflict, not only in Ukraine, but also in other parts of Europe, especially in the Balkan countries, because it would divert attention from the present conflict. Lets be calm and try to keep the peace in all the ways we can”.

Due to the fact that in Serbia it is often forgotten that both Ukrainians participated in the liberation of Belgrade in October 1944, as well as the fact that Ukrainian high officials visited Belgrade during the NATO bombing in 1999, Tolkach said: “This is an old story, but indeed Ukraine began to support Belgrade back then. Our then Foreign Minister, Mr Boris Tarasyuk, refreshed my memory when he told me: “I remember when we came to Serbia and tried to stop the bombing”.

-He (Tarasjuk) was here with the Minister of defence, and they tried to find some kind of compromise. Unfortunately, Miloševi? was not ready to do so at the time. Today, black humour is very popular in Ukraine and I heard from Mr Tarasyuk: “I came to stop the war, but my visit brought only bombs to the Serbian people, and, unfortunately, my visit did not have any positive result," said the ambassador of Ukraine.

The EU is a priority

Commenting on the year 2030, as a new possible date for the enlargement of the Union, the ambassador of Ukraine points out that he "hopes and believes" that both Ukraine and Serbia will become the EU members meanwhile, because this is the only way these countries can develop in this situation. I remember a time when Russia also tried to establish very close ties with the European Union, and now, unfortunately, it always claims that we are privileged, Ukraine and other post-Soviet states. We are "frozen" in this process (accession to the Union) because of Russia, and Russia has never asked others when it creates its foreign policy. We have our stable priorities, and the EU is one of our priorities and we will try to achieve that as soon as possible”, Tolkac said.